The following is a transcript of the "Chat with Dr. Cantrell" from February 18, 2009.
Links to additional resources and information from the chat transcript are included to the right.
dr._cantrell:
How is everyone tonight?
joan:
Pretty well, thank you. And you?
dr._cantrell:
I am great. Thank you.
Does anyone have a question?
Salsmom:
i missed a phone call. He is nearing the end of his deployment, he is with 2/9
sa818:
yes I do
dr._cantrell:
That must be really difficult to miss calls from your Marines.
sa818:
I have a son who is back from his second deplyment for 4 months and going on his 3rd, he has become detached from me and his 2 brothers and I can't undertand why
Salsmom:
Dr Cantrell are the men really different when they come back? my son was married right before he left, he is only 21, i fear they did it to soon and should have waitedd
dr._cantrell:
The detachment is very normal. Look at it from his perspective for a moment:
He knows that he is about to leave again in the very near future. He has his guard up and does not want to get too emotional and tied into family because he must keep his motivation up in order to do his best down range.
Salsmom:
i wonder how this will affect my son upon his return and how do we help him through it
sa818:
do they ususally come back to us before they leave my son will not even talk to us I have tried to call, email, text and get nothing
dr._cantrell:
This is the most difficult part for the families; feeling the separation and emotional distance.
Salsmom:
wow i really felt that last night and had a good cry for myself, it really helped
dr._cantrell:
Not usually, and of course it varies from person to person, because we are all different. Sometimes they are so guarded that they avoid contact with people they would normally connect with.
sa818:
I cry all the time, I spoke to the chaplin on base and he told me to back off of him so I have
sa818:
they stay away for good?
dr._cantrell:
They are different and so are you. It is when they know they will be home for longer periods of time, or are discharging that they begin to come back. I say that they freeze up their hearts, and they become battle hardened and this is survival for them.
sa818:
how do we as his family handle this
dr._cantrell:
Yes the Chaplain is correct. Give him his space and don't over mother him. This is a very hard pill to swallow, and it hurts, but it is very good advise.
sa818:
I feel like I am grieving over a death but he is alive
Salsmom:
that will be hard, i overmother my children that arent in the military:)
dr._cantrell:
As a family you also find ways to put up a little defense so it doesn;t hurt so bad. find ways to connect with the rest of your family and do not expect your Marine to join in as they did before, but do be grateful if they decide on their own to join you.
sa818
we all live in differant states and are trying so hard, his dad died and I am remarried and my husband says I am consumed with him
dr._cantrell:
Yes, this is a grieving process. But on the other side of the grief is an incredible young Marine will emerge, with amazing skills and integrity.
sa818:
Yes I know that and I am so very proud of him, but I am just hurting so much as I feel like I have lost him and get very angry at times I want to scream
dr._cantrell:
He is your son and this is normal, but please don't forget to nourish your lrelationship with your husband, or he will feel neglected and you lose on all fronts. You need to have a place to land and to nourish your heart and need to be loved and give love. Do this from a distance with your son, but focus on building you marriage.
sa818:
my biggest fear is that when he leaves for his next deployment something will happen to him and this is the way we ended not talking
How do I do this from a distant with my son when he won't talk to me
dr._cantrell:
Yes, there are all sorts of emotions that come up that can feel conflicting and also bring about guilt. Sure you are proud of him and his decision to serve our country, but at the same time many of you may be angry because they are now committed to their new family: The Marine Corps and in some ways it changes the nuclear family but it will come back together in time.
minimom:
how about a good old fashioned letter that just says hey, ilove you and am proud of you and will wait here at home for you when ever you need me
dr._cantrell:
Let your son be, and send him a letter with a care package or something he needs and just let him know that you carry him in your heart, you are proud of him, and love him unconditionally, and most importantly you will be there for him if he needs you.
sa818:
Thank you for your advice it is gratefully appreciated. Also I just ordered your two books.
jacks:
they are very good books
dr._cantrell:
We never know from moment to moment what will happen and sure you are affraid of him being wounded. Shore up your social support system to get through this time.
sa818:
Thats what I have heard
joan:
Is it within the realm of normal for anger to surface after they get out?
dr._cantrell:
Thank you very much for ordering my books. My new one will be out within the next 3-4 weeks.
jacks:
I am waiting for the new one
sa818:
I will watch for it :)
joan:
There seem to be some triggers that set our son off.
dr._cantrell:
Yes, of course and you know anger is just a combination of emotions that ferment. So you have grief, despair, sadness, loss, anxiety, etc. all bound up together, and these are feelings that are expressed in anger, some people use tears, some people get physically ill, but it is all expressed someway. So tease out the emotion you are truly feeling and write about it. Use this as an opportunity to learn more about what the true feelings are and how to cope more effectively.
joan:
There was an article in our paper yesterday about a local soldier facing murder charges that really set him off.
dr._cantrell:
Yes, absolutely, triggers are all around them. They are fighting in an urban setting and they are returning to an urban setting, so they are set off by things that we just take foregranted in our daily lives. These are things that take on new meanings for them.
joan:
He is usually a very mild mannered guy, and the best descriptor I can think of is he was like Mt. Vesuvius.
dr._cantrell:
Yes, unfortunately, some of the soldiers and Marines are havings some great difficulty when returning home. Their anger sometimes gets the best of them, and they are triggered to the point of acting out. The calm before the storm. This is why it is not good to "stuff it"
joan:
He was all over the place with anger...anger with people not understanding, not having a clue what it is like over there, anger with the thought of recall, he hopped from one opint to another.
sa818:
Joan, my son was always smiling and joking and loving I see pictures of him on the computer and I see anger and meaness in his eyes
joan:
It was only verbal and not directed at anyone, I just had the pleasure of being in the room
sa818:
your son is out of the marines now
joan:
Yes. I see a coldness. Yes, he has been out 5 months.
dr._cantrell:
There is a part of them that know they are capable of going off on someone if they are triggered, so he was probably disappointed that the soldier did not control himself better, or he may think of course that this one soldier has set a bad example for the majority who do not act in such a way.
joan:
I had not considered that perspective.
sa818:
does your son want to go back in
joan:
No. He has a job he loves and he really wants to move past this.
sa818:
I wish him well
joan:
Yet, 4 months ago, he was thinking seriously of activating himself. I suspect there is some conflict there.
sa818:
does he get outside help for this or trying to work it out on his own
joan:
He has not saught any help.
dr._cantrell:
The reason they call is POST traumatic stress is because it can happen at any time. We find that 3-6 months after getting out or being home, things start to show up and they feel like they are not adjusting as well as they had anticipated. If they are getting out often they feel out of sorts because they are not with their fellow comarades, and they don't see how they fit into the civilian world. There are just so many aspects to this.
sa818:
my son shold have got out this July but he re-uped while on his last deployment for another year and gets to be deplyed this fall
joan:
That makes a lot of sense.
dr._cantrell:
Yes, this is where his Family is, his military family, and this gives him meaning and purpose and he feels accountable to his brothers and sisters in uniform. At least this is certainly very common.
joan:
I think a part of him feels guilty because he did get a job. He mentions almost daily how fortunate he is. Then he also mentions his friends who are reenlisting because they have not found work in the civilian world.
joan:
So, I do think it bothers him.
dr._cantrell:
Yes, this is probably the case. They sometimes feel that they do not deserve to excell and leave others behind. They never leave a comrade behind, and in their way of thinking this could be a form of this mindset
joan:
He did mention wanting to find time to go to the VA. I don't ask him questions, I just listen.
sa818:
I just feel so sorry for all of them to be in this situation we had healthy young men and now I don't know what I have but listenting to the dr. I see it is very common so I will sit back wsend him a letter and let him know he is loved and I and the rest of us are here for him, I don't even have a address so that will be a challlenge itself
dr._cantrell:
You can get an address from someone that knows how to contact the unit, but do not go outside the protocol of contact. Find out the proper channels to write to him
sa818:
minimom are you ok your quite doyou have a question for the dr.
sa818:
I will ask the chaplian
minimom:
i am just listening and learning, my boy is still in the states, but maybe not for long, i want to be ready
sa818:
I don't know if we are ever ready
dr._cantrell:
yes preparing
sa818:
I have a older son who served for 10 years went to war also and he is fine and well adjusted has been out for a year now night and day between brothers
minimom:
i was not ready to be a mom ,but i took good care of myself when i was preg and had a healthy baby, nnow i want to have a healthy man/marine
sa818:
as we all do I agree
dr._cantrell:
yes, you all want to remain healthy. This helps all the way around.
sa818:
do we suffer from Pstd also is that what we are feeling
minimom:
he calls and is down in the dumps, but hears a happy proud mom and by time we get off the phn he is in a better mood
sa818:
thats nice mom
dr._cantrell:
Yes, family members can suffer stress symptoms, sleepless nights, anxiety, tearfulness, isolation, but it is not the same as you Marines, but it is certainly something that needs to be watched.
sa818:
my husband tells me I need to talk with someone so I can understand how to handle him
dr._cantrell:
Yes, good for you, stay upbeat, and don't give him reason to worry about the homefront, they must stay mission focused and combat ready.
minimom:
we talk about the families babies and the dog...dad picking up poop or the weather , jsut chit chat
dr._cantrell:
Yes, your husband is right, but he too should be part of the process, so you two are a unified front, and he can better understand your perspective and you understand his as well.
sa818:
gee, I did not think of that you see his connection with him is not like mine as he is the step dad and I believe son is still mouring his dad for he only passed away a year ago and he was just getting deployed again
came home to Homecoming with me and stepdad stepmom does not play a role to much into there lifes
dr._cantrell:
Yes, a son's relationship with his father, especially when he transitions to manhood is very important, and I am sure there are so many things that he would like his father to know about him. Was his father in the military?
sa818:
No thre is no military backgroud in our family his brother went to OCS and spent 10 years and he has been in 3 1/2 years
his dad died unexpected of heart attack he was 53 years old
dr._cantrell:
That is a tragic loss and I am sure a great loss for him
sa818:
and even though we were divorced we always did family things togethr right uup until the time he died. yes to us all
dr._cantrell:
This is beautiful that you were connected as a family, and he has all these wonderful and sweet memories to cherish for his lifetime. What a great Mom you are!!
sa818:
ty
jacks:
that is great
dr._cantrell:
Mimimom how do you stay connected to your Marine?
sa818:
And I am happy it was like that and my new husband was very much a part of it also, and we do it with his ex and his kids peopkle think we are crazy but it is so healthy for the kids
they are not even kids they are young adults and men
dr._cantrell:
You are not crazy, you are very loving mature and evolved individuals!!! If only more would be so selfless, it would be wonderful thing and our children would benefit tremendously.
minimom:
i got a laptop with a web cam a cell phn and lots of letters and cards. we also have spiderman , he guards the eggs. its a family thing that the grndson started.
dr._cantrell:
This is great, so you it sounds like you are staying in good contact and make it a family thing
sa818:
I bought my sons webcams for christmas a wonderful gift I am waiting for my marine to use his
dr._cantrell:
This is great
minimom:
yes, but i sont expect him to send letters or call, just happy when he can, mail is for him not for me.
sa818:
when my son was deployed I think I bought out hallmark
bow_lady:
dr. cantrell, thank you and you were right about what they like to do during leave after deployment, my son had a great time home. when get went back, he had a school thing to do. he ended up getting in trouble with another marine, underage and disorderly. i know this can be sometimes common, what and if are there any red-flags i should watch for? He sounds pretty good for the most part, but being mom i have to worry alittle
dr._cantrell:
sometimes it is difficult for them to respond as we wish.
minimom:
i sont send many hallmark cards, just notes and sometimes stuff out of the paper or a mag tht he might find funny or interesting. some times just with a big smily face on the page.
jacks:
That is great minimom
dr._cantrell:
If you recall what he got into trouble for and if he was using substances or whatever he did be aware of the anything that resembles this type of behavior.
jacks:
i did the same thing
sa818:
believe me I write letters send magazines, games, newspapers so he knows what is going on back home and pictures.
minimom:
hey bowlady , your kid must be hanging out with mine ::smile
dr._cantrell:
They love it when you send things from home like local articles, etc. keeps them a bit more connected to home.
bow_lady:
2/7?
dr._cantrell:
SOOOO you are not alone, some get into trouble, I know this first hand.
bow_lady:
ok, i understand, its nothing to be alarmed about yet
dr._cantrell:
I remember my dad telling me how he and his buddy used to shoot out the street lights 60 years ago, now he would be arrested. Things have changed!!
bow_lady:
i guess its their way of venting
dr._cantrell:
Boys will be boys!!
minimom:
i have no ideal what 2/7 is but mine is only out of training for about 9 months now, he is doing stuff here in the states
bow_lady:
2nd battalion, 7th marines 29palms, Ca
dr._cantrell:
Yes, there are many ways to vent, but it is my hope to help them find good ways of venting, because they can get tripped up so easy and into trouble. They act out and feel omnipotent and push the envelope
joan:
Drinking, sometimes excessively, seems somewhat common when they return stateside.
JAM:
Dr. Cantrell - is there any info if previous head injuries make you more likely to have PTSD
minimom:
3rd battalion cac, kbay, HI. he is only 20 and has been doing the drinking thing, maybe he will be one of the lucky ones and is just sowing his oats.
dr._cantrell:
Drinking, self medicating in a variety of ways can get them into trouble. It is very common and part of the military culture, but this coupled with the need for adrenaline can be a bad combination.
dr._cantrell:
As far as head injuries (TBI or Traumatic Brain Injuries) the signature wound of this war. The effects of head injuries can certainly make one more vulnerable to more head injuries. Many of the injuries involve slow bleeds, or microscopic tears in nerve tissue etc. and if this keeps happening there will be some negative effects.
Mood is affected, sleep, cognitive aspects, balance, planning, memory impulse control etc. but it all depends on the severity and location of the wound.
There is still a great deal to learn and they are doing more sophisticated testing to determine the extent of the injuries. Even the experts are having a difficult time discerning PTSD and TBI symptoms in some ways.
jacks:
yes they are
sa818:
Well Dr. Cantrell I am leaving now but Iwant to Thank you for your wonderful advice and everyone else and look forward to speaking with you again, and I will be expecting your books in a few days and will start reading and willwatch for your new book, We are lucky to have you to help us in all situations.
minimom:
isnt PTSD physical after the brain is cemicaly changed?
dr._cantrell:
Actually some of the experts are saying that PTSD also has some physical aspects. They have found there is actual changes in brain structures, etc. It is all connected, Mind Body and Spirit. TBI have a lot of similarities to PTSD in terms of symptoms, in addition to all of things I just mentioned in the previous email, there are many more signs and symptoms for both TBI and PTSD.
minimom:
good night and sweet dreams sa818
sa818:
thanks mom and good luck to everyone with there Marine
dr._cantrell:
WIth TBI there are sometimes physical changes in visual acuity, hearing, and those types of things, but not always. So it is very challenging for even the TBI experts
jacks:
Dr Cantrell..I want to Thank you for emailing with my son Justin..You have no idea how much you are helping him
dr._cantrell:
You are welcome Jacks. I am happy to be of help.
JAM:
I'm new to the chat rooms - are you here on certain nights/times. I have to help my daughter with her social studies homework so I also have to leave.
joan:
Dr. Cantrell is here one night a month...
jacks:
But the other chatrooms are open of an evening
joan:
We always get the word out as soon as we have the date.
dr._cantrell:
You can also read my books for more information and they are for sale on this website here
jacks:
And they are Great Books with Alot of Information
joan:
Yes, they are.
JAM:
thanks
minimom:
Dr. Cantrell, do you have aMarine? How did you get into helping Marines and the families?
dr._cantrell:
My father was a Sailor during WWII and Korean War, and I grew up with a deep love and respect for my dad and his service. During graduate school I did a practicum at a VA and the program closed because of funding issues, and it was devestating, so I decided to write my dissertation on PTSD in VN veterans and how Social Support mitigates these symptoms. So my life has just been a great journey and honor to work with all branches of service. I have worked with veterans for nearly 20 years, and
minimom:
yes, up till 20 years...My Dad was a Sailor and sometimes I wonder how I raised a boy that wants to be aMarine, or in the service at all, but hen I think about being proud of my Dad and its not so hard to see how my bot wants to do this.
usmcmom1981:
hi joan. nice to see u
dr._cantrell:
Working with your Marines, and all the branches is where my heart is, and my life's quest.
usmcmom1981:
my brain is on overload
usmcmom1981:
i have met some vets this week
minimom:
thank you for your service to our children.
usmcmom1981:
and of course they noticed my hat i wear in memory of my son
usmcmom1981:
a Marine
dr._cantrell:
It is truly my pleasure to be there for them and for you. We are all in this together!
usmcmom1981:
i met another former Marine Air Wing like my son
usmcmom1981:
and i have cried but thats ok
dr._cantrell:
Crying is healing, and connecting with others who remind us of those we cherish is a positive step, and touches not only your life but the life of those you meet. I am so sorry for your loss
usmcmom1981:
ty
as he was only 21 i try to come into this site and chat rooms to try to help others understand
u not only can have losses at war but also while they are on leave
it also helps me
dr._cantrell:
This is very important and your contributions to their experience is so valuable.
usmcmom1981:
i try to have people understand it doesnt or never will take away that pain but u can live day to day
and try to be good to each other and help one another as long as u r here
usmcmom1981:
As i have also lost a grandson age 16
dr._cantrell:
No one will truly understand your experience, but having you present is an inspiration
usmcmom1981:
2yrs ago
usmcmom1981:
i sure hope so dr cantrell
lot of people think i am strong
it is not strong it is called Faith
jacks:
Yes usmcmom1981..God bless you
usmcmom1981:
tks jacks
dr._cantrell:
Yes, it Faith, and knowing that each day is a new beginning.
joan:
Deb, you are always very supportive.
usmcmom1981:
tks both of u
usmcmom1981:
some people say i am so scared for our marine to go to war
but i try to tell them when it is there time there is nothing u can do
it can happen anywhere
jacks:
yes it can
usmcmom1981:
i am one of the proof of that
usmcmom1981:
i try to be blunt but use couth
if u can understand tht
dr._cantrell:
Yes, this is true. We can chose to live in fear of losing our loved ones, or we can live and value each moment we have
usmcmom1981:
very true dr cantrell
usmcmom1981:
i have learned the hard way
so i try to explain that to others
dr._cantrell:
We can all perish in a moments notice anytime, so we must learn to live and really live in the moment and cherish these moments
usmcmom1981:
i cherish everymoment with my family even more now than i did before nothing i take for granted
I cry everyday and that is ok I prob will the rest of my life and that is ok also
dr._cantrell:
This is what happens to our men and women in uniform once they experience Down Range or Traumatic loss, they know that it can happen at any time.
usmcmom1981:
yes for sure
dr._cantrell:
Crying means you have tender feelings for your dear son, and he will live in your heart for all time.
usmcmom1981:
yes he will
usmcmom1981:
well i just wanted to stop in and say hi to all
usmcmom1981:
tks for the talk and letting me talk
joan:
Take care Deb.
usmcmom1981:
see u all again
joan:
Blessings.
usmcmom1981:
nite hugs and prayers to all
usmcmom1981:
ty
jacks:
Always Welcome usmcmom1981
Prayers to you usmcmom1981
marinemomboston:
can i ask a question
minimom:
folks come an go really fast here!
dr._cantrell:
please ask
marinemomboston:
i always here about the marines having ptsd, how do you help them deal with that when they end up back on base after deploy?
do the marines give them support they need? If they were home, a mom could make sure they had the support
dr._cantrell:
Sometimes going back on base after they deploy is good medicine, it gives them social support and they are in an environment that is safe and predictable.
marinemomboston:
what are the most common ptsd that you should expect
dr._cantrell:
Anger, sleep issues, drinking, isolation are some of the most common. of course jumpiness, disconnection, lack of conversation
marinemomboston:
wow
dr._cantrell:
Read my book Down Range to Iraq and Back for a detailed description to understand in more detail.
marinemomboston:
ok i will. thanks
jlindell:
Dr. Cantrell, my son is having severe emotional problems, questioning his decision because of hazing he's going through
dr._cantrell:
It sgives you the basics, and then Once a Warrior Wired for Life, goes beyond the sypmtoms and how they reintegrate
dr._cantrell:
He is going through a hazing by his own Marines. This is something that used to be the norm, but I think they are trying to change that process.
jlindell:
He came home a month ago for a short weekend with a severely swollen face. He is a tough kid, loyal and wanted to become a Marine. He says he hates it and would rather be dead.
jlindell:
I'm scared
jlindell:
He's also scared to talk to anyone, even us.
dr._cantrell:
You may need to intervene or at least ask someone what is going on, This is not acceptable. I know that Tracy has an attorney whom I met who may be able to address these questions. If you are scared that he might hurt himself go through the process of letting the chaplain know or his CO.
jacks:
Yes contact the Chaplain maybe
dr._cantrell:
Then find a veteran for him to talk to. He can email me and I will discuss this with him.
jlindell:
His commanding officer told him some words I can't repeat.
He's afraid to do anything for fear of making it worse.
dr._cantrell:
I would talk to the Chaplain in confidence and have him go along if he is willing to do so. There is a reality to this, so do not be passive. Take action and sort out the consequences later.
jacks:
How long has your son been in the marines
jlindell:
Really? That's not the advice I've received from other parents. "Tough it out, etc."
jlindell:
He started infantry training in October.
dr._cantrell:
Tough it out and take the chance of something going bad, I don't think I would take that chance. I think you need to sort it out with him, but do not be passive.
marinemomboston:
can I ask why would they have hazing?
dr._cantrell:
Tough it out is standard babble, you know better than anyone if your son is truly having a difficult time, or if he is being manipulative to get out. Sort it out and listen to your findings.
jacks:
I don't understand why there would be hazing & a CO letting it happen
jlindell:
Are you asking me? I don't know.....My son and I both had this idea of commaraderie building. He has not seen ONE SINGLE BIT of that so far. He's discouraged, depressed and feeling very lonely.
dr._cantrell:
Maybe his expectations are not real. Being a Marine is a tough journey, and many of them really do break down and want their families, so this could be just a normal process. In his eyes he may see it as hazing, but I would still check it out with a Chaplain to get a reality check.
jlindell:
He LOVED bootcamp. He was a squad leader two of three months. He did not want to be a rifleman but was assigned the job because he was placed in medical for three days for back probs.
dr._cantrell:
They are toughening him up, because the Marines according to my understanding are cross trained, and they all go into infantry training, this is what they do.
marinemomboston:
night all
joan:
G'night, Boston
jacks:
All marines are rifeman first
dr._cantrell:
Yes, this is a requirement
jlindell:
He chose infantry because he wanted to do recon or sniper or mortarman. his problems seemed to start when he went to medical. He said it was a big mistake but his staff srgt. told him to because he was having severe back problems.
dr._cantrell:
Well sometimes we have to look deeply at all of this, and come to terms that we all have different strengths, but the Marines are tough and they expect excellence in all aspects of their requirements. I am so sorry your son is having some difficulties. Watch it closely, and help him sort this all out.
minimom:
goodnight and thanks for all the info and the welcome feeling. I enjoyed my evening with youall.
joan:
Good night, mini. Blessings to you and your Marine
dr._cantrell:
Good night all, and blessing to you and your Marines.
